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TOPIC: satire examples in literature Discworld Novels AND 20th Century British fantasy/sf/satire
#6301
Anastasia (Visitor)
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satire examples in literature Discworld Novels AND 20th Century British fantasy/sf/satire  
Interesting points, certainly, and I don't disagree. But there's a difference between parody and satire. It's not necessary for me to eliminate parodic works (since sometimes both parody and satire are part of the same work: see Discworld for example), but satire is the necessary element. Satire isn't necessarily parody, but it's not clear to me how parody can be not satire. Isn't parody essentially satire via the medium of imitation? Simply, satire is meant to trigger change. Parody isn't. That's an oversimplified version, and very frequently, bordering on usually, the *are* mixed. But you do get pure strains.May have covered that in the Watch essay, may have not. I am doing the following thing for several reasons: it's easy to get me started in didactic mode, and because exams and my dissertation are looming
 
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#6302
The Roxter (Visitor)
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satire examples in literature Discworld Novels AND 20th Century British fantasy/sf/satire  
Interesting points, certainly, and I don't disagree. But there's a difference between parody and satire. It's not necessary for me to eliminate parodic works (since sometimes both parody and satire are part of the same work: see Discworld for example), but satire is the necessary element. Satire isn't necessarily parody, but it's not clear to me how parody can be not satire. Isn't parody essentially satire via the medium of imitation? No. For instance, Repossessed was a parody of The Exorcist, but it wasn't even remotely satirical. That said, I'd have trouble defining what satire *is* - it's much easier to say nope, that's not it . PARODY par‧o‧dy  1.      a humorous or satirical imitation of a serious piece of literature or writing: his hilarious parody of Hamlet's soliloquy. 2.      the genre of literary composition represented by such imitations. 3.      a burlesque imitation of a musical composition. 4.      any humorous, satirical, or burlesque imitation, as of a person, event, etc. 5.      the use in the 16th century of borrowed material in a musical setting of the Mass (parody Mass). 6.      a poor or feeble imitation or semblance; travesty: His acting is a parody of his past greatness. –verb (used with _object_) 7.      to imitate (a composition, author, etc.) for purposes of ridicule or satire. 8.      to imitate poorly or feebly; travesty. BURLESQUE bur‧lesque  1.      an artistic composition, esp. literary or dramatic, that, for the sake of laughter, vulgarizes lofty material or treats ordinary material with mock dignity. 2.      any ludicrous parody or grotesque caricature. 3.      Also, bur‧lesk. a humorous and provocative stage show featuring slapstick humor, comic skits, bawdy songs, striptease acts, and a scantily clad female chorus. –adjective 4.      involving ludicrous or mocking treatment of a solemn subject. 5.      of, pertaining to, or like stage-show burlesque. –verb (used with _object_) 6.      to make ridiculous by mocking representation. –verb (used without _object_) 7.      to use caricature. SATIRE sat‧ire  1.      the use of irony, sarcasm, ridicule, or the like, in exposing, denouncing, or deriding vice, folly, etc. 2.      a literary composition, in verse or prose, in which human folly and vice are held up to scorn, derision, or ridicule. 3.      a literary genre comprising such compositions. CARICATURE car‧i‧ca‧ture 1.      a picture, de_script_ion, etc., ludicrously exaggerating the peculiarities or defects of persons or things: His caricature of the mayor in this morning's paper is the best he's ever drawn. 2.      the art or process of producing such pictures, de_script_ions, etc. 3.      any imitation or copy so distorted or inferior as to be ludicrous. –verb (used with _object_) 4.      to make a caricature of; represent in caricature. It all seems rather nebulous and difficult to pin down. -rockhazy
 
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#6303
Anastasia (Visitor)
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satire examples in literature Discworld Novels AND 20th Century British fantasy/sf/satire  
It all seems rather nebulous and difficult to pin down. S'why I've had to go to graduate school for 4 years to be able to talk about it, innit? But seriously, there's overlap. These are fuzzy categories precisely because they're de_script_ions of a fuzzy process because people are incapable of perfectly clear thought, because they use protein jelly to think with.
 
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#6304
satire examples in literature Discworld Novels AND 20th Century British fantasy/sf/satire  
 These are fuzzy categories precisely because they're de_script_ions  of a fuzzy process because people are incapable of  perfectly clear  thought, because they use protein jelly to think with. I sincerely, and with great admiration, need to sig this. Pretty please, with your choice of leather accoutrements on top? April.
 
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#6305
Anastasia (Visitor)
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satire examples in literature Discworld Novels AND 20th Century British fantasy/sf/satire  
Anastasia wrote... <snippo  These are fuzzy categories precisely because they're de_script_ions  of a fuzzy process because people are incapable of  perfectly  clear thought, because they use protein jelly to think with. I sincerely, and with great admiration, need to sig this. Pretty please, with your choice of leather accoutrements on top? On top of whom? But please do.
 
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#6306
Anastasia (Visitor)
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satire examples in literature Discworld Novels AND 20th Century British fantasy/sf/satire  
[snip] But, using this list as the basis, how about rounding it out? They're all 20th century, all British, all sf&f. And mostly male. Any women to add? No more men if possible. Naomi Mitchison? Some of her books can certainly be classed as SF. John
 
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